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Digby's Hullabaloo Posts

Great Game

Kevin links approvingly to Emma’s interesting post about French motivation in opposing the invasion of Iraq and “how the game of nations is played.”

However, I’m afraid I think her assessment is entirely too cynical. Yes, Chirac is a snake and nations act out of their own interests. Much more than principle or morality, by necessity and because we are humans, always goes into foreign policy. Nobody with any brains is arguing that France is acting purely out of altruistic love of the Iraqi children or entirely because they have a moral objection to war. That would be a silly and naive position.

But, neither can it be discounted that France is a democracy and Chirac is responding to the will of his citizens. Perhaps public opinion is irrelevant to him, but one cannot prove it merely by assertion. There is every reason to believe that Chirac would find himself under the kind of pressure that Blair is under and has decided to take a different tack based upon his personal self-interest, which is how the system is actually designed to work. It’s hard to see that Chirac was particularly free under those circumstances to decide the issue based solely upon France’s oil interests in the mid-east or his ambition to lead the EU, even if he wanted to. If he were acting out of economic self-interest alone, Chirac would have held out for the best deal and then played ball. That is certainly what the Bush administration expected to happen.

I also think she gives short shrift to the notion that the “Old Europe” experience of the last century has left them with a genuine suspicion of grand global plans like the starry-eyed neocon dream of Pax Americana and that assessment does have some basis in morality. (Certainly, the German position is undeniably rooted in its moral culpability for WWII.) They all see their own security in terms defined by two world wars fought on their own soil and they rightly mistrust propagandist phrases like “benevolent hegemony.” Yes, that is “self-interest” but it isn’t necessarily cynical and it isn’t necessarily a hypocritical stance that would change if the players were different.

In other words, it’s not naive to believe that there is a mix of genuine democratic principle and hard edged self-interested realism in France’s position. That position, after all, is mirrored by far more countries than ours is and most of them do not have interests in Iraq that make it the least bit worth their while to side against the United States. Indeed, it cannot be seen as in the self interest of any individual nation. The U.S. is a powerhouse, both militarily and economically and there is little to be gained by a country like Chile or Mexico defying us on a war in a far off region in the world.

It is not believable to me that this large collection of democratic countries throughout the world are lining up against the US out of calculated individual self-interest alone. There are selfish motives involved in each, to be sure, but they are responding to their people and taking a big gamble that their collective power will serve to check what seems to be a very aggressive U.S. foreign policy doctrine. It’s a ballsy move that makes no real sense if there is not a deep seated feeling amongst these players that the US must be put on notice that we do not have unfettered support for these global ambitions.

That global alliance of the unwilling simply cannot be explained as another Great Game.

Show Yer Cards

What a cocky, smirky, son-of-a-bitch.

This guy had a hard-on for war today. He is angry and he is excited and he is babbling incoherantly.

Yee Haw.

“We’ll Meet Again Someday…..”

Post Script:

It will be interesting to see if Karl’s vaunted bandwagon effect will come to pass as it’s obviously designed to do. Now that it’s on for sure will everybody come scampering to be with the “winners?” We’re about to find out.

And somebody should have given Junior a couple of valium before he went out there. He sounded suspiciously like he was about to declare war on France.

Bush aide: Inspections or not, we’ll attack Iraq

GEORGE Bush’s top security adviser last night admitted the US would attack Iraq even if UN inspectors fail to find weapons.

Dr Richard Perle stunned MPs by insisting a “clean bill of health” from UN chief weapons inspector Hans Blix would not halt America’s war machine.

Evidence from ONE witness on Saddam Hussein’s weapons programme will be enough to trigger a fresh military onslaught, he told an all- party meeting on global security.

Former defence minister and Labour backbencher Peter Kilfoyle said: “America is duping the world into believing it supports these inspections. President Bush intends to go to war even if inspectors find nothing.

“This make a mockery of the whole process and exposes America’s real determination to bomb Iraq.”

Dr Perle told MPs: “I cannot see how Hans Blix can state more than he can know. All he can know is the results of his own investigations. And that does not prove Saddam does not have weapons of mass destruction.”

The chairman of America’s defence policy board said: “Suppose we are able to find someone who has been involved in the development of weapons and he says there are stores of nerve agents. But you cannot find them because they are so well hidden.

“Do you actually have to take possession of the nerve agents to convince? We are not dealing with a situation where you can expect co-operation.”

Mr Kilfoyle said MPs would be horrified at the admission. He added: “Because Saddam is so hated in Iraq, it would be easy to find someone to say they witnessed weapons building.

“Perle says the Americans would be satisfied with such claims even if no real evidence was produced.

“That’s a terrifying prospect.”

First of all, why the hell is Richard fucking Perle speaking for this country before members of parliament? Can somebody please explain what position he holds that allows him to go around the world shooting his mouth off as if he has some position of authority?

There can be no good purpose for them to want him telling the Brits at this moment that the entire inspections process has been a sham from the get-go. Why do they let him do this?

He seems to be having a bit of a public meltdown, what with the Hersh nuttiness, and I have to wonder why they don’t tell him to shut his piehole.

It’s Over?

Jayzuz, that’s got to be the shortest “summit” in history.

President Sleepytime must have to get back before “the Wonderful World of Disney” starts tonight.

talk about pointless….

Whaddo I do now, Condi?

I haven’t read Woodward’s book “Bush at War” because, well, the thought of paying money to Bob Woodward to observe him give George W. Patton a metaphorical blow job smacks a little too much of voyeurism. But, it seems I’m going to have to do it just for the shock and awe value.

Maureen Dowd, in a surprisingly dark and realistic column today (and one which should be shoved into her face the next time she goes all Alpha Bitch Queen and forgets that she’s not writing about the entertainment business) says:

And America is not known for its long attention span or talent for empire building. As Bob Woodward reports in his book “Bush at War,” a month into the bombing of Afghanistan, when the Taliban stronghold of Majar-i-Sharif fell, Mr Bush turned to Condoleezza Rice, in a moment right out of “The Candidate,” and asked: “Well, what next?”

He turned to Condi and asked what next. Has there ever been a more callow, infantile president in history?

President GI Joe likes to play with the toys that go ker-pow, but he’s “not into nation building.” What do you suppose the chances are that he remains interested in Iraq after Shock and Awe starts to get so, like, boring?

This Summer I Hear The Drumming

Atrios via Roger Ailes points out this nice story of some fine military “security” officers and their off base cross burning antics. These are some of the same military “security” officers who have authorization to use deadly force to protect residents and equipment from protesters on base — at their discretion

Not all MP’s are white supremecists by any means, but it should be remembered that this is why we have a system of justice. We don’t let cops shoot to kill except in self-defense. It is impossible to believe that protesters could threaten some sort of vital equipment at Vandenberg Air Force base in California that would threaten the lives of servicement in Iraq. If they can, then somebody needs to take a much harder look at the security of the base overall rather than putting out the word that they are going to shoot first and ask questions later.

Tin Soldiers And Junior Coming

Vandenberg Air Force Base authorizes ‘deadly force’ against trespassing protesters

VANDENBERG AIR FORCE BASE, Calif. (AP) – Security forces at Vandenberg Air Force Base may use “deadly force” against protesters if they infiltrate the military complex if a war starts, officials said.

Some anti-war activists plan to trespass onto base grounds in hopes of disturbing Vandenberg’s mission and to vandalize sensitive equipment they contend helps guide the war effort.

Vandenberg officials revealed Friday that military security police may shoot to kill, if necessary, to protect base residents and machinery.

Anti-war protesters have a habit of threatening “base residents.” And protecting “machinery” is a patriotic duty. Shoot the bastards. Where do they think they live, America?

Strangely, I’ve seen lots of this kind of thing, but I have yet to see any kind of “Down With Saddam” signs. Who, exactly do these people think we are going to war with?

Hesiod links to the following article and explains that this means the “pro-war” rallies are actually “pro-al Qaeda” rallies.

Anger on Iraq Seen as New Qaeda Recruiting Tool

By DON VAN NATTA Jr. and DESMOND BUTLER

LONDON, March 15 — On three continents, Al Qaeda and other terror organizations have intensified their efforts to recruit young Muslim men, tapping into rising anger about the American campaign for war in Iraq, according to intelligence and law enforcement officials.

In recent weeks, officials in the United States, Europe and Africa say they had seen evidence that militants within Muslim communities are seeking to identify and groom a new generation of terrorist operatives. An invasion of Iraq, the officials worry, is almost certain to produce a groundswell of recruitment for groups committed to attacks in the United States, Europe and Israel.

“An American invasion of Iraq is already being used as a recruitment tool by Al Qaeda and other groups,” a senior American counterintelligence official said. “And it is a very effective tool.”

Another American official, based in Europe, said Iraq had become “a battle cry, in a way,” for Qaeda recruiters.

Some of the information about Qaeda recruiting comes from interrogations of captured operatives and from materials found at the house in Rawalpindi, Pakistan, where Khalid Shaikh Mohammed, the third-ranking Qaeda leader, was arrested this month, officials say.

Crystal Ball

Matthew Yglesias says:

I’ve often wondered what, exactly, the UN’s critics proposed that we put in its place. Well, David Gelernter has risen to the challenge with results that are a bit … odd.

The core of the new organization–call it the Big Three–would be a Britain-Russia-America triumvirate. The underlying principle: No credible world organization could include only countries we like. But Russia’s fluid condition gives us an unusual opening. Russia is a big country with a vivid history. No organization that includes Russia could possibly be America’s cat’s-paw. Yet Russia is uncertain of what she wants; she is open to persuasion. Yes, that means money; but international prestige is worth even more, especially to a humbled former champion. Including Russia (but not China or France) in the ruling committee might impart just the right soupçon of anti-Americanism to the new organization, which must be credible yet not intractable

There is much one can say about this, the most obvious being that this ridiculous concept that time is going to stand still and the US, Britain and Russia will always be in the exact positions they are currently in is well…dumb. But, instead of writing a thousand words I’ll offer this instead:

Proud To Be An American

I just saw some fair and balanced footage of rallies, with scrupulously equal time given to the story of the hundreds of anti-war rallies thoughout the world and the one “Patriot” rally in Atlanta on CNN. They reported that the pro-war rally had expected 10,000 but were happily surprised to have doubled that number. The organizers finally feel they are “getting their message out.”

To the melodic strains of Lee Greenwood, I watched one of the speakers whip the crowd into a frenzy by saying We thought they were the only ones out there…the ones with hairy underarms…lesbians or whatever. (much hooting and laughing from the crowd) We thought we were surrounded by…California. (booooooo) But that’s not true. We surround them!”

The commentator said that most of speeches were primarily concerned with criticizing Hollywood and anti-war protesters.

Has anyone heard a lot of speechifying at the anti-war rallies against fellow citizens? I have been to some and watched a bunch on C-Span, and I don’t remember anybody saying anything disrespectful of the American people, but instead confined themselves to the politicians who are making war policy — which, after all, is the traditional way of politics.

I could respond in kind and insult say…the entire red-state region with rude comments about certain rural stereotypes, but that wouldn’t be polite.

Hey, TBOGG….

UPDATE:

Here’s the transcript. I forgot about the “freaks in limousines.” Note the fawning CNN commentary:

DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, promoters here were predicting a crowd of about 10,000 here at Atlanta, at the Rally for America, but they’re now saying on the podium that they have more than doubled that.

Let’s take a look at this crowd. People coming out today, decked out in their red, white and blue, thousands of people. Thousands of people carrying banners and signs, offering patriotic sentiments and supporting U.S. troops.

A part of what you’re looking at could also be the power of talk radio. Stations across the country have been promoting rallies for America. They’ve been striking a chord that seems to resonate deeply with people in this crowd. They are pro-U.S., pro-military.

And some of the featured speakers also taking shots at anti-war demonstrators, particularly Hollywood celebrities protesting war in Iraq.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We were starting to believe that we were surrounded by them, by the ones that are the freaks in the limousine, the ones with the hairy armpits and the lesbian, whatever that is. We thought we were being surrounded by California.

Today, today, I’m proud to tell you they are clear, we surround them

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: Things wrapping up right now. They just had the song, “Proud to be an American” playing. People singing along with it.

Again quite a few thousand more people than they expected for this rally, particularly with this kind of rain. So promoters very happy with the showing here today and people leaving with a very good feeling that their opinion is being made known across the country.

Back to you.

WHITFIELD: And David, to make it clear, the folks that are assembling there in Atlanta say this is not a pro-war rally but instead, it is one showing patriotism, showing support of the troops, as you mentioned, as well as the president’s plans?

MATTINGLY: That is the theme here, support for the troops, for American soldiers right now in the Middle East. They say they don’t want a repeat of what they saw after Vietnam, where soldiers came home and were not treated with respect. They want to make sure that does not happen again this time.

But there are some political undercurrents going on. There’s a lot of signs here, a very partisan in support of the president, and a lot of signs critical of anti-war protesters, as we showed you before

That’s an undercurrent??